What do I do next? IG, Congress, Art. 138, nothing?

jdlancas519

Registered Member
#1
So, I'm hurt, have an LOD, 2 Doc memos asking for an extension, and 2 7574-1s (unfit for duty mil and civ). I'm not getting any responses from my Com. Commander. My BDE Commander has made the decision I don't get ADME orders. I also just emailed some Recovery Care Coordinators at the 88 RSC. I don't know what they do or can do. What do I do next? This is depressing, I'm a bit heated... I need a level headed Course of Action. I don't know if I am in the wrong.
My email:
BDE Commander,

I hope you are doing well. I was CCed on an email from SFC XXXXX that you have made a medical determination that my condition doesn't require ADME orders (attached emails). I believe in accordance with DoDi 1241.01 (paragraph 3a(2)) that I should have been retained on active duty (ADME). I have included 2 memos for an ADME extension and 2 7574-1s (unfit for military duty). I spoke with MAJXXXXXX (Company Commander) and he said he would look into it, but I haven't heard back. I'm sure the coming AT has him quite busy.

Please write me back and let me know what decisions have been made about me, and if there is a reason I was not informed. I want ADME orders in order to have the best possible care. The surgeon wanted to do a Bicep Tenodesis, but we decided to delay surgery until I've escalated the issue. In the very least INCAP Tier 1 should have been initiated. Thank you for your time and assistance.

v/r,

Me

Response:

You are not required to be on orders to receive the medical care you need according to my understanding therefore you will not be placed on orders. Use the chain of command to pursue medical RMAs. HHC can assist you.


Best Regards,

BDE Commander
 

poohbear331

PEB Forum Veteran
Registered Member
#2
I don't know the answer but just reading the first line of the email "that you have made a medical determination"
sarcasm- is your BDE Commander a physician?
 

jdlancas519

Registered Member
#3
He is not a physician... And that was the point. My orthopedic surgeon requested I stay on orders and my bde commander stopped that because he doesn't think my treatment requires it... He says my medical requirements Don't require Care other than rmas... He has decided this by not letting me submit a adme packet
 

poohbear331

PEB Forum Veteran
Registered Member
#4
what does the BDE surgeon say?
what about the treating physician (active duty)-what is their opinion- does this "need to be fixed"
 

jdlancas519

Registered Member
#5
We don't have a BDE Surgeon. The Active Duty doctor has put what he intends to do in the memorandums i submitted. Something must have changed in the last 24 hours since they are now moving. They are trying to push me to take INCAP pay because they say USARC will most likely deny the orders... IDK.
 

poohbear331

PEB Forum Veteran
Registered Member
#6
From reading other threads -you got hurt on orders and are entitled to incap pay. Orders- if surgeon says the has to be don (necessary) they " shouldn't" deny orders

Others are more knowledgeable in this area
 

FloridaInjuredInCombat

PEB Forum Veteran
Registered Member
#7
Best advice I can give is to google search, download DA PAM 135-381 (INCAP), read it over, and pay special attention to both Soldier and Unit Responsibilities.

The way it is "supposed" to work when you incur an LOD injury as a Reserve Component Soldier that prevents you from either working your Civilian Job or performing drill a set of things are set in motion.
(A) you receive immediate medical treatment if needed, at government expense.
(B) command initiates an LOD investigation, and you are BRIEFED on INCAP (something that rarely happens).
(C) you FORMALLY REQUEST INCAP through your Unit CO.
(D) unit then has 10 days to process your request and send it to the Office of the State Surgeon (OTSS)
(E) OTSS must process your INCAP claim and INITIATE INCAP PAY within the FIRST 30 DAYS of your INITIAL REQUEST FOR INCAP PAY.
(F) AS YOU'RE BEING PAID, the LOD investigation continues to completion.
(G) IF the LOD investigation in found to NOT be in the Line of Duty, YOU MUST PAY BACK THE INCAP PAY (Recoupment).
(H) This (A through G) covers you for the FIRST SIX MONTHS, after that the process goes to NGB (if you're Guard) where they decide to continue or stop INCAP.

That's the way it's supposed to happen... Here's what I've seen go wrong.
- Units either fail to inform Soldiers of INCAP, or they tell them there's "no money for it" or just flat out refuse to process the claim.
- State SITS on the INCAP claim IGNORING the NLT 30 days to initiate pay requirement, often demanding the LOD be done first, which often is NEVER completed.
- State uses ANY and ALL excuses to DELAY, DENY, STOP, or INTERRUPT both INCAP pay and medical care.
- Soldiers get frustrated and eventually are quietly encouraged to process out without benefits.

The latest underhanded thing, I've run across a PPT from the Army Reserve Command (I'll have to track it down and upload it for you tomorrow) that uses the omission of the NLT 30 days for INCAP pay safeguard that WAS in DOD 1241.2 (dated 2001) but left out of DOD 1241.01 (2016) to INTENTIONALLY and as POLICY make the Soldier wait WITHOUT INCAP pay until the entire LOD process is complete and THEN make them wait for a longer protracted INCAP review process. Meaning they INTENTIONALLY and as POLICY are now delaying INCAP pay anywhere from 8 months to a year or more, before the Incapacitated Soldier ever sees a dime of INCAP pay. Wrong beyond words.

That's pretty discouraging, but until they flat out tell you that the new (above) policy is in effect, work of the INTENT written into the Regs (AR 135-381) and DA PAM 135-381. In other words DON'T TELL THEM that the HQ wants to screw you.

Since you already have your LOD (which is great) and already have a couple 7574-1's (also great), I suggest you FORMALLY REQUEST INCAP through your unit CO. Keep in mind, mentioning you're due INCAP is not the same thing as FORMALLY REQUESTING it.

Pretty simple, write an E-mail (For record and time/date stamp) to your Unit CO. Reference DA PAM 135-381, and note it outlines Unit Repsonsiblities (including the 10 days the unit has to process your INCAP claim and get it to OTSS / State). Don't forget to say the words "I FORMALLY REQUEST INCAP PAY". Include a copy of your LOD approved, and the 7574-1's. Also, state your financial situation being unable to work due to the LOD injury severely impacts yourself and YOUR FAMILY. That OFFICIALLY puts your CO on notice that the clock is ticking and the ball is IN his court.

After that, it's a WAR OF WILLS. Politely but persistently keep tracking your unit's progress, and IF they refuse to do it, or are dragging beyond the 10 days they are allowed, seriously consider filing an IG Complaint with your State. They MAY come back with the aforementioned BS from AR-HRC, if they do, then it's time to get Congressional help, but DON'T MENTION that BS if they don't.

This "Should" get the ball rolling. Constant pressure was the key to my success, but it took EVERY BIT of patience I had. Fight and land punches, but then take a break from it, and find something to get your mind right. Too many get wrapped up and frustrated, take a breath when you have to.

I hope this helps, and I'll get that power point uploaded so you can see what the SOB's are trying to pull.

One more thing, IF you're injured to the point you might not be able to stay in the military, you should be entered into the IDES (integrated disability evaluation system) for a SSMRB (State Surgeon medical review board), MEB (medical evaluaton board), and PEB (physical evalution board), with the end goal of either Medical Separation or Medical Retirement, both with pay and benifits. DON'T LET THEM RUN OUT THE CLOCK ON YOUR ETS OR ADMIN DISCHARGE YOU, CHEATING YOU OUT OF BENEFITS DUE. If that's the case, we've got more to talk about....
 

FloridaInjuredInCombat

PEB Forum Veteran
Registered Member
#8
INCAP Pay if you're unable to perform your military duties (drill) is equivalent to FULL Active Duty pay, including BAH and BAS. IMHO it's a better option than being put on orders for the RC (Guard or Reserves), since they tend to NOT give you any housing or subsistence allowance, and you don't have to sit in the armory all day unable to work.

If you're able to drill but can't work in your civilian job, your INCAP pay should reimburse you for lost wages UP TO but NOT OVER what your Active Duty pay would have been. I'm not sure if that includes BAH and BAS, since I wasn't in that category, I was not able to attend drill (unfit for military duties on the 7574-1's).

Last but not least, IF you're receiving any VA disability benefits for the same injury. It USED TO BE that such funds were offset (taken from) the INCAP pay. It was NEVER allowed to do this by Law, and recently (last year or two) both the DOD and and Secatary of the Army put out word to the effect to NOT offset VA disability from INCAP pay. So you get to keep BOTH.

Hope this helps...
 
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