21 Years of service MEB initiated and have a few questions

F

Flip4flop

PEB Forum Regular Member
Registered Member
Great forum here with a ton of resources that I have been reading through over the past week. I just wanted to share my current situation and see if there was anything that I might be wrong about or if there was anything else I should be doing in order to prepare appropriately.

About me:
20.5 years of service (21 years in May)
MEB initiated on 22 Nov
Completing the last VA appointment on 2 Feb
PEBLO said still on track for 21MAY23 completion date

I do not have the option to retire even though I am over 20 years due to being enrolled in USASMA and having an additional service obligation (long story where stars aligned where I could not decline and retire due to alot of stuff happening where I live that was also military induced). The MEB is something I have been working toward for the year due to a surgery performed by the military that went sideways resulting in nerve damage and more.


That being said I have no idea what to anticipate for my rating (have been told almost every over 20 usually gets over 50% due to what we have all been through). I would concur with the amount of pain I live through almost every day but am terrified the rating comes back lower than I think despite reading the 38 CFR and overanalyzing every little detail.

My understanding is that since I am over 20 years I will receive my full retirement pay and VA disability without reduction (CRDP). I am a little confused on what I need to be concerned with as far as the Army rating comes back as. If VA rates me 100% and Army rates me 20% does that have any impact on my benefits?

In addition I am working on getting enrolled in a CSP and hopefully have the support of my command (have verbally said they would) to extend whatever my NLT comes back as to ensure I can complete the program and take the leave I have accrued (~110 days)

What am I missing or am I wrong about? If the VA rating comes back and I do not agree with it, will this be what m PEBLO/MSC helps with or do I need to seek outside assistance?

Thank you all in advance for your thoughts
 
It should not impact if you are rated at 20% because you are going to get your high three retirement and VA if rated over 50%. I am going through the same thing. I am Active Duty Navy with almost 22 Years and was worried about the same thing. I just got my ratings back from VA at 100% and I am waiting on my DOD rating as we speak. I was told by my IDES Lawyer that since you are over 20 you will get your high three. Hope this helps!
 
TmoneyWO said:
It should not impact if you are rated at 20% because you are going to get your high three retirement and VA if rated over 50%. I am going through the same thing. I am Active Duty Navy with almost 22 Years and was worried about the same thing. I just got my ratings back from VA at 100% and I am waiting on my DOD rating as we speak. I was told by my IDES Lawyer that since you are over 20 you will get your high three. Hope this helps!
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Re: Over 20 years service

That could be 20 Good Years for a non-regular retirement or 20 years active duty for a regular retirement.

It has been my observation on this forum that retirees who qualify for either a regular retirement (20 years AD or more) OR
a non-regular retirement (reserve/NG) use the term “more than 20 years service”.

One major difference:
—if otherwise qualified, the regular retiree receives CRDP immediately
—if otherwise qualified, the reserve/NG retirement has an age requirement and the retiree cannot receive CRDP until they reach the age required. An application for reserve/NG retirement is usually submitted several months before reaching age 60 (or an earlier age due to certain deployments).

Ron

edited to add: @TmoneyWO Your 22 years active duty was noted. The thread just reminded me of the occassions I have requested clarification from an a retiree (or potential retiree) whether his or her 20 years were good years or active duty.
It makes a difference in several computations. In fact, a clarification is often needed for the characterization for service of less than 20 years.
 
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@Flip4flop, take the MEB and run. The Army, DoD, can come back with whatever rating they want. If it’s a 20% rating, it doesn’t matter. You have 20 plus years of service which means you will get your 50%… well 52.5% in May. Let’s not forget this important fact, if you are currently on the E9 list the likelihood of you getting promoted the day before your Medical retirement/retirement is extremely good, whether you have completed SMA or not. Check these out… AR 635-40 Para 4-30.C ( c. Grade to which the Soldier would have been promoted had it not been for the physical disability for which the Soldier wasdeterminedunfit. Ingeneral,thisprovisionpertainstoSoldiersonapromotionlist.ForActiveArmyandRCenlisted disability cases, this option is implemented under the provisions of AR 600–8–19…). The para for AR 600-8-19 para 1-21. My peers that have been found unfit, were promoted the day they final out and their DOD retirement is based off the pay grade which they were promoted to upon final out. High 3 goes out the window. E-7 promoted to E-8. Getting paid as an E-8. Hope some of this helps. I am also assuming you are Active Duty or have 20 plus year of Federal time.

I am in a similar situation as you. I have research and asked and dug around. At this point it’s what’s best for my family and myself.

Also, if you don’t like the rating I would talk to your JAG rep and I would go the formal PEB route.

I am no expert by any means. I also wanted you to see the AR so you have the actual material to refer to.
 
Flip4flop said:
My understanding is that since I am over 20 years I will receive my full retirement pay and VA disability without reduction (CRDP). I am a little confused on what I need to be concerned with as far as the Army rating comes back as. If VA rates me 100% and Army rates me 20% does that have any impact on my benefits?
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I can’t speak accurately about your situation, but if you get VA and DoD you may get some reduction of DoD pay depending on circumstances because of caps. @RonG is smart on these things.
 
chaplaincharlie said:
I can’t speak accurately about your situation, but if you get VA and DoD you may get some reduction of DoD pay depending on circumstances because of caps. @RonG is smart on these things.
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Hello @Flip4flop
cc: @chaplaincharlie

I mentioned earlier,
Re: Over 20 years service

That could be 20 Good Years for a non-regular retirement or 20 years active duty for a regular retirement.

It has been my observation on this forum that retirees who qualify for either a regular retirement (20 years AD or more) OR
a non-regular retirement (reserve/NG) use the term “more than 20 years service”.

One major difference:
—if otherwise qualified, the regular retiree receives CRDP immediately
—if otherwise qualified, the reserve/NG retirement has an age requirement and the retiree cannot receive CRDP until they reach the age required. An application for reserve/NG retirement is usually submitted several months before reaching age 60 (or an earlier age due to certain deployments).

CRDP restores only the longevity portion of retired pay and a 50% or more VA rating is required.
—if retired at 20 yrs AD = immediate CRDP if otherwise qualified
—if retired at 20 good years for reserve retirement = receives CRDP upon attains tge age requirement if otherwise qualified

Ron
 
Mike_Honcho said:
@Flip4flop, Check these out… AR 635-40 Para 4-30.C ( c. Grade to which the Soldier would have been promoted had it not been for the physical dMy peers that have been found unfit, were promoted the day they final out and their DOD retirement is based off the pay grade which they were promoted to upon final out. High 3 goes out the window. E-7 promoted to E-8. Getting paid as an E-8. Hope some of this helps. I am also assuming you are Active Duty or have 20 plus year of Federal time.

I am in a similar situation as you. I have research and asked and dug around. At this point it’s what’s best for my family and myself.

Also, if you don’t like the rating I would talk to your JAG rep and I would go the formal PEB route.

I am no expert by any means. I also wanted you to see the AR so you have the actual material to refer to.
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Hello from an alumnus of Class 30, USASMA, July 1987 -January 1988
@Mike_Honcho @Flip4flop

A couple of comments.

1. I found no basis for the use of final pay in the scenario described, after reviewing the Financial Management Regulation and current laws.
2. A senior contributor to this forum was promoted to Major the day before his retirement and his pay was computed using high three, not final pay.

Regards,
Ron
cc: @tony292
@chaplaincharlie @Provis

edited to add, about high three.

Scenario: Regular retirement after serving two years as a SGM/E9

His/her regular retirement pay would be computed as the total of 24 months E9 pay plus 12 months E8 pay, divided by 36 = high three average base pay. High three x longevity multiplier = retired pay

Jason Perry offered in 2011:
[START].
"(3) Disability retirement grade: Under 10 USC 1372, the grade at which a Soldier is permanently retired for disability or placed on the TDRL is the highest of the following options: current grade; highest grade satisfactorily held; or the grade to which the Soldier would have been promoted had it not been for the disability retirement. The latter option includes those on a promotion list who have met any required cut-off score and those who have met the time requirements for an automatic promotion. For Soldiers who entered the military after
7 September 1980, retirement at promotion-list grade will have no impact on retired pay. This is because they fall under the high-36 month average of basic pay instead of final basic pay. Actual promotion is not required to be retired at promotion-list grade. However, Army enlisted promotion policy allows promotion on the last day for those whose promotion eligibility date is after the disability retirement/separation date. Officers are retired at promotion list grade without actual promotion because officer promotion law is interpreted to preclude promotion ahead of promotion eligibility date.

(4) Grade for disability severance pay: Under 10 USC 1212, the same options as described above pertain to the grade at which disability severance pay is computed. Unlike disability retirement, severance pay at promotion list grade does increase the amount of disability severance pay. Actual promotion reference promotion-list grade is the same as described for disability retirement. "[END]
 
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High 3 still applies. I had been promoted prior to my referral to the PEB, but had not obtained 36 months time in grade. I extended the process based on legal advice. I ended up with 35 of 36 months at the higher grade.

What is waived in the service commitment for TIG.
 
@chaplaincharlie and @RonG I appreciate you both correcting the issues within my statement. I have spoken with the individuals I was referring to in my comment earlier, the way they said how they were getting retirement pay was cleared up. 100% high 3, as you have stated.

This whole process sucks. The amount of research and everything else I have had to try and do on my own is ridiculous. No body I have spoken with during this actual process seems to know what they are talking about, I t’s extremely ridiculous. If it weren’t for this site and some of my research, I would be floating further out in outer space.

Thanks gents for clear that up.
 
They dont make this easy that is for sure. Just got back my ratings
VA- 100%
DoD- 10%
Permanent

I was fine with it all until I went into the office with the PEBLO and he said because I am under 30% DoD rating I only get the VA compensation and not any military retirement. Based on what everyone here is saying and what I have read on DFAS his information seems incorrect. The DoD should not matter and I should be able to elect to receive the 21.5 active duty years of service high 3 retirement and also receive my 100% from the VA. Made an appointment with legal for tomorrow to discuss and now have to worry about this all night as that would drastically impact my budget planning.
 
Flip4flop said:
They dont make this easy that is for sure. Just got back my ratings
VA- 100%
DoD- 10%
Permanent

I was fine with it all until I went into the office with the PEBLO and he said because I am under 30% DoD rating I only get the VA compensation and not any military retirement. Based on what everyone here is saying and what I have read on DFAS his information seems incorrect. The DoD should not matter and I should be able to elect to receive the 21.5 active duty years of service high 3 retirement and also receive my 100% from the VA. Made an appointment with legal for tomorrow to discuss and now have to worry about this all night as that would drastically impact my budget planning.
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Let me know how that turns out. That’s the first I have heard of that happening. Especially being over 20 years. You should still get 50% DOD and your 100% VA. Curious let me know.
 
Mike_Honcho said:
Let me know how that turns out. That’s the first I have heard of that happening. Especially being over 20 years. You should still get 50% DOD and your 100% VA. Curious let me know.
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Going through a minor freak out now with how that would change everything in my retirement planning. Makes no sense to me since everything says you need a DoD rating of under 30% AND under 20 years of service to potentially only get a severance pay separation. If that is the case I will be appealing and fighting like hell to get my DoD rating up to 30%.
 
PEBLO is wrong as DFAS will compute your retired pay based on being over 20 active duty years not the 10% disability percentage. It’s at least 30% OR 20 years. If you’re still concerned call DFAS they will tell you the same.

“Permanent Disability Retired List
If your disability is found to be permanent and is rated at 30 percent or greater, or you have 20 or more years of service, you will be placed on the Permanent Disability Retired List (PDRL).

Your retired pay will be computed using one of two methods.
  • Your disability percentage, referred to as Method A.
  • Your years of active service, referred to as Method B.
Your pay will be computed based on whichever method is more beneficial for you.”

 
Well happy to report back that my PEBLO called back about 20 minutes ago to apologize on his mistake and that I was correct in receiving military retirement for 21.5 years of active service. Disaster avoided.
 
Flip4flop said:
Well happy to report back that my PEBLO called back about 20 minutes ago to apologize on his mistake and that I was correct in receiving military retirement for 21.5 years of active service. Disaster avoided.
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I knew something sounded fishy.
 
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