AGR Question 7200 PTS

S

sccrain82

PEB Forum Regular Member
Registered Member
Hi Everyone,

I am posting here because I am having an issue with the attorney saying that I cannot have a regular retirement even if I have over 7200 total creditable points during CH61. Maybe I am wrong in how I am reading it, but from what I read in the regulation and what it says on DFAS if you have over 7200 creditable points for retired pay you will be entitled to CRDP (I know they changed it but can't remember at the moment).

I have over 18 years active and 23.5 active/reserve time. The reason I am asking is because I am getting conflicting information. If I won't get a regular retirement with 7200 points, then I will get out now otherwise I will wait a few months and get the 7200. If there is someone that could maybe point me in the right direction I would appreciate any help.

Hope everyone had a great 4th.
 
sccrain82 said:
Hi Everyone,

I am posting here because I am having an issue with the attorney saying that I cannot have a regular retirement even if I have over 7200 total creditable points during CH61. Maybe I am wrong in how I am reading it, but from what I read in the regulation and what it says on DFAS if you have over 7200 creditable points for retired pay you will be entitled to CRDP (I know they changed it but can't remember at the moment).

I have over 18 years active and 23.5 active/reserve time. The reason I am asking is because I am getting conflicting information. If I won't get a regular retirement with 7200 points, then I will get out now otherwise I will wait a few months and get the 7200. If there is someone that could maybe point me in the right direction I would appreciate any help.

Hope everyone had a great 4th.
Click to expand...
Hello,

With 20 Good Years and meeting the age requirement, one can retire as a reservist or NG. If otherwise qualified, they can receive their longevity retirement amount simultaneous with VA comp (at age 60 which can be less for certain deployments).

Regular retirements are based on active duty time, not points; your attorney is correct.

Ron
 
sccrain82 said:
Hi Everyone,

I am posting here because I am having an issue with the attorney saying that I cannot have a regular retirement even if I have over 7200 total creditable points during CH61. Maybe I am wrong in how I am reading it, but from what I read in the regulation and what it says on DFAS if you have over 7200 creditable points for retired pay you will be entitled to CRDP (I know they changed it but can't remember at the moment).

I have over 18 years active and 23.5 active/reserve time. The reason I am asking is because I am getting conflicting information. If I won't get a regular retirement with 7200 points, then I will get out now otherwise I will wait a few months and get the 7200. If there is someone that could maybe point me in the right direction I would appreciate any help.

Hope everyone had a great 4th.
Click to expand...
That answer to your question is here:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3i3ZRbHBpD8&t=3s


The answer is yes and no. Though its very complicated because points only can count towards AFS when medically retired via chapter 61. So 7200 points should get your CRDP if this interpretation is correct. We have had mixed results with some on this forum saying yes it worked and others say no it didn't. You might even want to have your attorney check out the same video to see what they say.
 
Unless the Reg has changed or been amended since 12 Jan 17 read AR 635-40 para 4-27 (1) (a) (b) (c) and DA PAM 635-40 para 3-12. Under the regulation at that date 7200 pts is based off of combined AD, Membership, and IDT pts. You will also receive CRDP if you meet those requirements.
It should tell you everything you need to know.
How do I know? It applied to me, our situations are similar.
 
Last edited:
Hello @macjac69

Thank you (again ) for your important report of your experience. It appears this prevails. “The retired pay of a member retired under chapter 61 of this title with 20 years or more of service otherwise creditable under section 1405 of this title, or at least 20 years of service computed under section 12732 of this title…”

Here is the applicable law:
(Full text at 10 U.S. Code § 1414 - Members eligible for retired pay who are also eligible for veterans’ disability compensation for disabilities rated 50 percent or higher: concurrent payment of retired pay and veterans’ disability compensation <—-Link)

10 U.S. Code § 1414 - Members eligible for retired pay who are also eligible for veterans’ disability compensation for disabilities rated 50 percent or higher: concurrent payment of retired pay and veterans’ disability compensation​


a)Payment of Both Retired Pay and Compensation.—
(1)In general.—Subject to subsection (b), a member or former member of the uniformed services who is entitled for any month to retired pay and who is also entitled for that month to veterans’ disability compensation for a qualifying service-connected disability (hereinafter in this section referred to as a “qualified retiree”) is entitled to be paid both for that month without regard to sections 5304 and 5305 of title 38. During the period beginning on January 1, 2004, and ending on December 31, 2013, payment of retired pay to such a qualified retiree is subject to subsection (c), except that payment of retired pay is subject to subsection (c) only during the period beginning on January 1, 2004, and ending on December 31, 2004, in the case of the following:
(A)
A qualified retiree receiving veterans’ disability compensation for a disability rated as 100 percent.
(B)
A qualified retiree receiving veterans’ disability compensation at the rate payable for a 100 percent disability by reason of a determination of individual unemployability.

(2)Qualifying service-connected disability.—
In this section, the term “qualifying service-connected disability” means a service-connected disability or combination of service-connected disabilities that is rated as not less than 50 percent disabling by the Secretary of Veterans Affairs.

b)Special Rules for Chapter 61 Disability Retirees.—
(1)Career retirees.—
The retired pay of a member retired under chapter 61 of this title with 20 years or more of service otherwise creditable under section 1405 of this title, or at least 20 years of service computed under section 12732 of this title, at the time of the member’s retirement is subject to reduction under sections 5304 and 5305 of title 38, but only to the extent that the amount of the member’s retired pay under chapter 61 of this title exceeds the amount of retired pay to which the member would have been entitled under any other provision of law based upon the member’s service in the uniformed services if the member had not been retired under chapter 61 of this title.
(2)Disability retirees with less than 20 years of service.—
Subsection (a) does not apply to a member retired under chapter 61 of this title with less than 20 years of service otherwise creditable under section 1405 of this title, or with less than 20 years of service computed under section 12732 of this title, at the time of the member’s retirement.

Ron

Also, the DoD Financial Management Regulation:

DoD 7000.14-R Financial Management Regulation Volume 7B, Chapter 64
* February 2023

See: https://comptroller.defense.gov/Portals/45/documents/fmr/current/07b/07b_64.pdf <—LINK
 
Provis said:
The answer is yes and no. Though it’s very complicated because points only can count towards AFS when medically retired via chapter 61. So 7200 points should get your CRDP if this interpretation is correct. We have had mixed results with some on this forum saying yes it worked and others say no it didn't. You might even want to have your attorney check out the same video to see what they say.
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Excellent and that led to @macjac69 ‘s anecdotal evidence. The payment of

concurrent payment of retired pay and veterans’ disability compensation might be pertinent here, but back to “regular retirement “ — it is not based on points. Regular retirement is active federal service. 7200 points does not necessarily equal regular retirement.​


Ron
 
RonG said:
Excellent and that led to @macjac69 ‘s anecdotal evidence. The payment of

concurrent payment of retired pay and veterans’ disability compensation might be pertinent here, but back to “regular retirement “ — it is not based on points. Regular retirement is active federal service. 7200 points does not necessarily equal regular retirement.​


Ron
Click to expand...
I don't know about anecdotal evidence. The only thing I can tell the OP is that I went thru a medboard was found unfit with an outcome of less than 30% DOD rating resulting two options.

Either go into gray area retired status because I had a 20 year letter (NG less than 7200 AD points) OR take a severance and seperate but because I fit the bill as outlined in the DA PAM and AR mentioned above I was granted a 20 year retirement at highest grade held because of previous Commissioned service based on my AFS, Guard membership points and Inactive duty points. Because I was already rated 50% or greater VA before the board I receive CRDP and being a Technician Fed Tech disability. My post really wasn't to enlighten about CRDP but the exception to the 7200 point rule when being medically retired for reservist.
 
macjac69 said:
I don't know about anecdotal evidence. The only thing I can tell the OP is that I went thru a medboard was found unfit with an outcome of less than 30% DOD rating resulting two options.

Either go into gray area retired status because I had a 20 year letter (NG less than 7200 AD points) OR take a severance and seperate but because I fit the bill as outlined in the DA PAM and AR mentioned above I was granted a 20 year retirement at highest grade held because of previous Commissioned service based on my AFS, Guard membership points and Inactive duty points. Because I was already rated 50% or greater VA before the board I receive CRDP and being a Technician Fed Tech disability. My post really wasn't to enlighten about CRDP but the exception to the 7200 point rule when being medically retired for reservist.
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Hello,

Thank you for your clarification.

The following are the general categories of military retirement of which I know:

1. Regular Retirement (requires 20 years active duty)
2. TERA (Temporary Early Retirement Authority) at 15 years for AD
3. Reserve/NG Retirement - Non-Regular Retirement (sometimes referred to as non-traditional retirement); 20 "Good Years" retirement
4. Disability Retirement (determined to be medically unfit for continued service and has a DoD rating of 30% or more)

A Congressional Research Report, Updated June 2024 shows:

There are three general categories of military retiree–active component, reserve component, and disability retiree.
Active component personnel are eligible for retirement (i.e., vested) after completing 20 years of service (YOS).
Reserve personnel are eligible after 20 years of creditable service based on a points system, but do not typically begin to draw retirement pay until age 60.
Finally, those with a disability retirement do not need to have served 20 years to be eligible for retired pay; however, they must have been found unqualified for further service due to a permanent, stable disability.

Ron
 
Per Army DA PAM 635-40 para 3-12

Twenty years of service as computed under Title 10 USC section 1208

IAW with 10 USC 1201 and 1204, a soldier determined unfit for compensable disability is granted disability retirement if the soldier has either 20 years of service computed under 10 USC 1208 or a minimum disability rating of 30 percent. It is important that PEBLO's, PEB adjudicators, and transition centers understand the computation of this service, as it can mean the difference between a disability retirement and a disability separation with severance pay when the soldier does not have the minimum 30 percent.
In general, the computation is the sum of the soldiers active service, the soldiers equivalent years of service for the soldiers membership, and/or Inactive duty training points. For regular retirement, this combination of service is called 10 USC 1405 service. Unlike regular retirement in which the 10 USC 1405 service is listed only after the soldier obtains 20 years of active Federal service, equivalent years of service is counted for disability retirement in meeting the 20-year threshold. In summary, a minimum of 7200 points of combined active duty, membership, and Inactive duty training points results in eligibility for a disability retirement.
 
macjac69 said:
Per Army DA PAM 635-40 para 3-12

Twenty years of service as computed under Title 10 USC section 1208 *selected text for quote*
Click to expand...
Hello @macjac69

In your opinion, what impact does this computation have (if any) on concurrent receipt of military retired pay and VA compensation (formerly CRDP)?

I don’t see it mentioned in Chapter 64 of the pertinent Financial Management Regulation.

Also, you mentioned, “…DA PAM and AR mentioned above I was granted a 20 year retirement at highest grade held because of previous Commissioned service based on my AFS, Guard membership points and Inactive duty points.” I infer that the 20 year retirement is a NG retirement with 20 Good Years. Is that correct? It would result in concurrent receipt upon reaching the age requirement for NG/Reserve retirement.

I am trying to better understand this esoteric situation. I am appreciative that you are contributing to this discussion.

Thank you,
Ron
 
At the conclusion of my medboard process at I was issued a retirement order of which my branch submitted to DFAS. I at the same time submitted an application for retired pay to DFAS after their audit and computations my retired pay started about a month or so afterward with concurrent receipt of full VA compensation.
In summary I did not have to wait to reach an age requirement which under normal NG retirement circumstances would have been the case. So for me in essence it was the equivalent of 20 years of active duty.
 
Hello @macjac69 ,

Reference: “In summary I did not have to wait to reach an age requirement which under normal NG retirement circumstances would have been the case. So for me in essence it was the equivalent of 20 years of active duty.”

Thank you for that significant explanation.

Ron
 
For quick reference when considering entitlement to CONCURRENT MILITARY RETIREMENT PAY AND DEPARTMENT OF VETERANS AFFAIRS (DVA) DISABILITY COMPENSATION

DoD 7000.14-R Financial Management Regulation Volume 7B, Chapter 64 * February 2023

VOLUME 7B, CHAPTER 64: “CONCURRENT MILITARY RETIREMENT PAY AND DEPARTMENT OF VETERANS AFFAIRS (DVA) DISABILITY COMPENSATION”

Selected text for status differences:


1.3.7. General Waiver Requirement. This is the general rule that a military retiree may not receive both DVA Disability Compensation and military retired pay simultaneously, but may waive military retired pay in order to receive DVA Disability Compensation. See 38 U.S.C. § 5304 and 38 U.S.C. § 5305. The General Waiver Requirement is always subject to the exception under 10 U.S.C. § 1414.

1.3.8. Exception to the General Waiver Requirement. This is the rule enacted in 10 U.S.C. § 1414 to make specific and limited exceptions to the General Waiver Requirement.

1.3.9. Qualified Retiree. This is a member or former member of the Uniformed Services who is entitled for any month to both retired pay and DVA Disability Compensation based on a service-connected disability (or combination of service-connected disabilities) that is rated by the Secretary of Veterans Affairs as not less than 50 percent disabling on the DVA schedule for rating disabilities. A Disability Retiree must be a Career Disability Retiree to be a Qualified Retiree. 1.3.10. Qualified Career Disability Retiree. This is a person who meets both the definition of Career Disability Retiree and Qualified Retiree.


2.1 Qualified Retiree To qualify for the Exception to the General Waiver requirement and receive military retired pay concurrently with DVA Disability Compensation, the member must be a “Qualified Retiree” as defined in paragraph 1.3.9. Career Disability Retirees who are qualified retirees may receive concurrent Title 10, U.S.C., Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay and DVA Disability Compensation, subject to certain limitations described in paragraph 2.3.4.

2.2 Qualifying Service-Connected Disability A qualifying service-connected disability is a service-connected disability (or combination of service-connected disabilities) that is rated by the Secretary of Veterans Affairs as not less than 50 percent disabling on the DVA schedule for rating disabilities.

*2.3 Physical Disability Retirement

2.3.1. Disability Retirees - Less Than 20 Years. Such members who do not have 20 years or more of service creditable under 10 U.S.C. § 1405, or 20 years of service computed under 10 U.S.C. § 12732, at the time of the retirement are not eligible to receive Title 10, U.S.C., Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay and DVA Disability Compensation concurrently. Accordingly, such members are subject to the General Waiver Requirement and must waive Title 10, U.S.C., Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay in order to receive DVA Disability Compensation.

2.3.2. Qualified Career Disability Retirees - 20 Years or More. Such members may receive concurrent Title 10, U.S.C., Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay and DVA Disability Compensation but, in certain circumstances, may be required to waive a portion of the Title 10, U.S.C., Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay.

2.3.3. Nature of the Payments. A Qualified Career Disability Retiree is entitled to be paid Title 10, U.S.C., Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay concurrently with DVA Disability Compensation. The Qualified Career Disability Retiree continues to receive Title 10, U.S.C., Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay. The nature of the Title 10, U.S.C., Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay is not changed because Career Disability Retiree becomes a Qualified Retiree under 10 U.S.C. § 1414.

2.3.4. Special Rules for Qualified Career Disability Retirees. The law limits the amount of Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay that remains subject to the General Waiver Requirement. Specifically, a Career Disability Retiree receiving Title 10, U.S.C., Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay must waive Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay, but only to the extent that the amount of Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay exceeds the amount of hypothetical longevity retired pay to which the member would have been entitled under any other provision of law if the member had not been retired for disability under Title 10, U.S.C., Chapter 61. After application of the limited general waiver requirement, a Qualified Career Disability Retirees will receive their Disability Retired Pay in an amount equal to the dollar amount of hypothetical longevity retired pay. In cases where a Qualified Career Disability Retiree’s hypothetical retired pay computation exceeds their Title 10, U.S.C., Chapter 61 Disability Retired Pay (based on percentage of disability), the General Waiver Requirement does not apply.

2.4 Non-Regular Retired Pay Members eligible for retirement for non-regular service are not eligible to receive both military retired pay and DVA Disability Compensation concurrently until they reach retirement age and have applied for and have become entitled to receive military retired pay. A member is generally not eligible for non-regular retired pay until they reach age 60. The eligibility age may be reduced in certain cases based on qualifying active duty in response to a national emergency after January 28, 2008.

---
Ron
 
Hi,

Thank you for sharing the information. Under 10 U.S. Code § 1414, members with a service-connected disability rated at 50% or higher can receive both retired pay and veterans' disability compensation concurrently. Chapter 61 retirees with 20 or more years of service face pay reduction only if it exceeds what they would get under different retirement provisions. Those with less than 20 years of service aren't eligible for concurrent receipt. The DoD Financial Management Regulation (DoD 7000.14-R, Volume 7B, Chapter 64) offers additional guidance.

Jack ;)
 
Jack,

See post 13 of this thread.

Ron
 
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