MMRB Downrange

pullemfar

PEB Forum Regular Member
So here's the deal, as you'll tell shortly I'm not very familiar with the whole MMRB ins/outs, I've been put in for an MMRB and my P3 is sitting on the Div Surg. desk as I type this. Monday I was told I wasn't deploying on this trip, but this morning I got word that I will going because "all the MMRB stuff can be done by my PA and BDE Surg. downrange"????????????????????? WTF, is that true, for one I'm still under the care of an Ortho surg and a Nuero Surg (my c3,4,5 are sitting on my spinal cord and causing numbness and tingling on the whole left side of my body), neither my PA or my BDE Surg has ever in the history of my neck and spine issue seen me for it. As a matter of fact this is the reason I was medevac'd back in May 08. Man this crap is really pushing my buttons, I feel like it's a good stiff F**king from the BN/BDE CMD just to get #'s. There's more to this, but right now, just trying to figure out whats up at this point. Can I get some insight? Thanks guys.
 
I'm assuming you are deploying to Afghanistan, Iraq, or some other CENTCOM jurisdiction. Do you have a profile (assuming you are Army)? Permanent or temporary?

Usually, if you are in the pipeline and have a permanent profile of any type you would need an ARCENT waiver before even being cleared to deploy. If you have a permanent profile and this has not been done, you would not clear medical in your pre-deployment screening. Hard to state exactly what is going on without all the facts, though.
 
Sorry about the limited info. Roger, I'm Army SSG (11B) deploying to A-Stan, I've been on a temp profile for quite sometime that was issued by my Ortho/Nuero Surg during their long eval process. And now by order of my BN CDR my PA has submitted (so he's saying) a perm profile up the chain (have'nt seen it) and initiated an MMRB (no ARCENT waiver yet and I do initial SRP in a couple days), they feel that the other medical professionals are moving to slow and they seem to be the only ones thinking that.

I don't know how all this stuff is suppose to go down, all I want from these guys is a no BS warno on whats gonna happen. I don't know if they are purposely dragging their feet to get 1 more Soldier/NCO downrange and then they got me, or if it's something else. I've come to realization that my days as a grunt are coming to a close and it's been a great ride. Wish i had seven more years in me, but I don't, 36 yo ain't no damn joke. I've had a herd rough life in an d out of the military. The Corps got the majority of my youth and the Army has taken what was left. Soory about that got a little off track.

Anyway, I'm beating the PA up for a copy of the perm. profile but no luck so far. Is their a way to find it in the system somehow, what can I do. At this point I want a copy so the Career Counselor can get an idea of what reclass options I may have. I'll go downrange and wait for school date, but them being able to conduct the MMRB while downrange, I'm throwing the flag on that one. Anyone else see that smoke??? The disgust and distrust is building cyclic rate, any advice?

Again thanks guys,
 
pullemfar,

MMRB's cannot be initiated without a permanent profile, so as you suspected, someone is dropping the ball. Also, I would checkout AR 40-501 Chapter 3 to determine if your condition fails retention standards and interferes with your ability to perform your duties (as a 11B, most likely it does). When a condition fails retention standards of AR 40-501 CH 3 the Soldier should be referred to a Medical Evaluation Board/Physical Evaluation Board for adjudication, not the MMRB.

Furthermore, while pending a MMRB you are non-deployable. AR 600-60 Chapter 3 Section 2 (3-2) makes this very clear:

3–2. Nondeployable status
Soldiers are nondeployable effective the date a permanent 3 or 4 profile is approved by the applicable medical
authority until one of the following actions occurs: The MMRBCA retains the Soldier; AHRC or the applicable RC
approving authority approves an MMRBCA recommendation for reclassification; or the PDES finds the Soldier fit.

Also of note:

3–6. Assignments
a. Soldiers who receive a permanent 3 or 4 physical profile after receiving assignment orders must appear before a
MMRB before proceeding on reassignment. A Soldier who is pending direct referral to a MEB for non-acute
impairments should be referred to a MMRB if the MEB will not be completed by the time the Soldier is to proceed on
assignment instructions. Soldiers pending finalization of a MEB will remain at their current duty location and not be
allowed to PCS until the MEB is completed.
---------------------

If I were you, I would check AR 40-501 CH 3 to see if your condition fails retention standards. As stated above, if your conditions do fail retention standards you should be referred to a MEB, not a MMRB (the MMRB will just refer you to the MEB anyway). Given the regulations and the apparent intention of your unit's medical staff to refer you to a MMRB, I do not see how you can deploy. Not only do the regulations prevent someone in your situation from deploying, but with a permanent profile you will not clear medical at SRP/pre-deployment screening. I understand you do not technically have a permanent profile yet but it seems that one is forthcoming.

What exactly is the nature of your condition? I have a feeling you may require referral to a MEB and your unit is dropping the ball here.
 
My c3,4,5 are sitting on my spinal cord and causing numbness and tingling on the whole left side of my body. I'm not familiar with all the medical jargon so thats straight laymans for you. Surgery is in the future according to the Ortho/Nuero Surgeons and the pain management clinic said my neck is to jacked to even risk an epidural at this point. Can't take lortab or perc's cause of the induced itching, I itch like crazy, keeps me awake all night. Have taken so much nuerotontin that I gained 24lbs. Doc took me off that for a while. Anyway, just going through the motions right now. Seeing how much more stalling and smoke blowing is involved. I see my Ortho Doc on the 22nd and see the Nuero Doc on the 31st, interested in what they'll have to say. Other than those two should I address this issue to anyone else. I do SRP tomorrow, but the final one before we fly out isn't till late Apr. or mid May. What other options do I have at this point?

Thanks Carnelli53 for all your help!
 
Well this about sums it up, however I responded well to the physical therapy initially, but once I was released to full duty it wasn't long before the symptoms came back and is what got me to this point. But again surgery is an option, just the last one the Doc's want to resort to until thaty have completely exhausted all other means. I won't argue, I'm not real fond of sharp objects near my throat and spine.​

3-39h. Nonradicular pain involving the cervical, thoracic, lumbosacral, or coccygeal spine, whether idiopathic or
secondary to degenerative disc or joint disease, that fails to respond to adequate conservative treatment and necessitates
significant limitation of physical activity.​
Range of motion (ROM) measurements should be obtained using a
goniometer (a bubble goniometer/inclometer is also acceptable). SF Form 527 should be used to document the ROM
and the method of measurement. Use the VA’s instructions for completion of spine and joint evaluations. This includes

the six measurements shown on VASRD Plate V ROM of cervical and thoracolumbar spine.
 
Update, just got off the phone with my PSG and he passed along to me that the BN CDR can send me downrange regardless of what any AR states. true or false? Is there a n AR that states anything like that or that could be interpreted as such. Who if anyone can be the approving authority to send a Soldier downrange with a Perm profile and pending an MMRB. Granted I haven't seen either one yet but I am a persistant f^(ker. Anyway just throwing that out there.

I'll check in later.
 
99% sure that this is false. It seems the ultimate approval authority for any type of MMRB 'deferment' is the Deputy Chief of Staff, G-1.

The current version of AR 600-60 from February 2008 is signed by General George Casey, Chief of Staff. This regulation and all other regulations, are for all intents and purposes, are direct orders from the Chief of Staff (not to mention the Secretary of the Army). Last time I checked, a LTC cannot contravene a 4-star General. /end sarcasm/

I am unsure why your PSG would make such a claim, but I am wholly unaware of any regulation that can be intepreted in such a way. I am pressed for time at the moment and will take a look at AR 40-501 CH 7 and AR 600-60 a little later. My gut instinct is telling me that your BN CDR is either attempting a coup d'etat of the entire chain of command or, more likely, is wrong.

Once you have a permanent 3 or 4 profile and are referred to a MMRB or MEB - you are non-deployable, simple as that.
 
Update: According to my 1SG and PSG; Pres. Obama has put into effect a policy that keeps Soldiers from getting MMRB's and directly goes to an MEB. Hit the bricks Soldier, your services are no longer needed. No reclass, nothing but the boot. TRUE or FALSE. Thats how it was layed out to me thios morning at SRP, MEB or Deploy.

Well after that conversation with those idiots I saw a medical readiness interviewer and she pulled up my MMRB that is up for review on MON.. I take that info back to the PA and I ask for a copy of my profile and he says I don't need a copy. Ended up going to my SGM and he took that to the BN XO, waiting on th results of that.

Man some of these ****ers in leadership positions are unreal. How does that happen? I've got my ideas, but WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW, hilarious!!!!!!!!!
 
pullemfar,

Haven't heard of any Presidential directive putting a halt to MMRBs, sounds like something out of a bad Steven Seagal movie. I'm glad that SRP at least recognized your medical situation, who was running the SRP by the way - your tenant unit or another unit on the same post? If the former, I would have treaded lightly (which I'm sure you did if that was the case).

Glad to see that at least someone is in the 'know' and is not conspiring against you. Now that you have confirmed you are in fact pending a MMRB, your next objective should be getting your hands on your profile. I don't think I've ever heard of a situation where a Soldier was denied from seeing their own profile, but common sense is telling me that is wrong (and I'm sure there is a regulation to back that up).
 
Yeah C53, I let my SGM in on this and he talked to the BN XO, so we'll see what happens now. But hey if they can't do anything for me and the MMRB board convene's, I fill them in on it when I get the flooor. Folks like this PA should be relieved of the duty's and sent packing. The way they treat Soldiers that are the ones that go out and put it on the line, is just disgusting and unbelievable, not saying that the PA's job is less of a hazard, but I've never seen PA's out the wire on any deployment I've been on. There's been complaint after complaint about this particular PA, but nothing but a little slap on the wrist. And if you're an NCO you don't stand a chance with this tool.

Yeah that crap about the presidential directive/policy, I felt like they should have atleast given me the opportunity to drop my trousers before they tried blowing that smoke up my arse. They even kept a straight face when they said. I even looked the 1SG in the face and said "1SG you and the Pres have one on one conversations together, wow thats cool", then comes the I have a johnson growing out of my forehead look. These last few days have been a roller coaster ride from hell with some amusement though.

C53, Bro I just want to thank you for the time you have taken to shed a tremendous amount of light on this issue. Pointing me in the right direction, I never thought I'd be in this situation of an MMRB so I just never eduacted myself on this stuff, but now I see that info is invaluable and not just for me but for my future Soldiers that may find themselves in this same situation.

You now the old saying "DON"T BITE THE HAND(S) THAT FEEDS YOU" well I'm a firm believer that the Soldiers(Joes) and NCO's on the ground feed the highers. If the guys on the ground run a muck then the CMD would be jacked up in the eyes of their leadership, but when boots on the ground do what they are suppose to do, hihger has the limelight and takes full advantage of it. But as we can all tell fewre and fewer CMD's see it that way. Tht's just my outlook on it, maybe I'm a little partial, but this is the topic to alot of NCO and or Joe conversation lately.

Sorry for that rant, just venting a little.

Have a good'un
 
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