Retiring, declined ceremony and now no recognition

Russ35057

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I found tooth and nail for mine. I wanted the presidential certificates, CMSAF certificate, the flag, all that stuff. I ended up emailing my unit several years later, I was retired via the AFBCMR, and they forwarded it to the First Sergeant who in turn ordered everything and had it sent to me. He even obtained a flag and had it folded by the Base Honor Guard and got me the lapel pin. Don't give up.
The current shirt for me is one of my commander's lackeys.... need I say more... but the wing king has my orders and is aware and so is the command chief.... Thursday is my last day and Friday is my first day of retirement.
 

ZG2010

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The current shirt for me is one of my commander's lackeys.... need I say more... but the wing king has my orders and is aware and so is the command chief.... Thursday is my last day and Friday is my first day of retirement.
Congrats on that last bit!
 

theunknowntoby

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The current shirt for me is one of my commander's lackeys.... need I say more... but the wing king has my orders and is aware and so is the command chief.... Thursday is my last day and Friday is my first day of retirement.

Congrats on retirement! I’m at work today and tomorrow, even though I’m supposed to be on my permissive TDY and terminal. But I feel much better knowing it’s the end.
 

Stealthmanx2

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"Normally" when one is retiring someone that is junior is picked at the POC to set up the ceremony to include get the certificates and flag. This may just be me, but if someone chooses not to have a ceremony but wants everything that comes with it, then getting all of that stuff is up to the retiree to apply for. Also, unless it has changed in the past 12 months, there is no funding for retirement flags and the person retiring has to pay for it.
 

RonG

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"Normally" when one is retiring someone that is junior is picked at the POC to set up the ceremony to include get the certificates and flag. This may just be me, but if someone chooses not to have a ceremony but wants everything that comes with it, then getting all of that stuff is up to the retiree to apply for. Also, unless it has changed in the past 12 months, there is no funding for retirement flags and the person retiring has to pay for it.
We all have opinions. My opinion is that the junior person should complete as much as he was charged to do.

That said...I did all my stuff without anyone's help. I even computed the years of service for retirement and completed the form it was recorded on. Personnel was on the floor above us (finance) and my secondary MOS was senior personnel sergeant. I suggested to the clerk that he ask his sergeant major to look it over.

I did not buy a flag. I advised my son to get one from the VA when I pass. VA and flag info: VA.gov | Veterans Affairs ,---LINK

Ron
 

Stealthmanx2

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The point I was making was if a person chooses not to have a ceremony then they aren't assigned someone junior. The whole point is for this person to help from A to Z with the ceremony. If there isn't going be a ceremony then the retiree should order their stuff. It's not that time consuming, like you said, just forms that you fill out.. Going to the flag which is what the OP is asking about, unless things have changed with unit funding of retirement flags, that has gone away due to budget cuts and flags are bought by the retiree. Like I said, might be back to the way it was, but I retired this time last year and I had to buy my shadow box flag and the flag the honor guard folded.
 

RonG

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The point I was making was if a person chooses not to have a ceremony then they aren't assigned someone junior. The whole point is for this person to help from A to Z with the ceremony. If there isn't going be a ceremony then the retiree should order their stuff. It's not that time consuming, like you said, just forms that you fill out.. Going to the flag which is what the OP is asking about, unless things have changed with unit funding of retirement flags, that has gone away due to budget cuts and flags are bought by the retiree. Like I said, might be back to the way it was, but I retired this time last year and I had to buy my shadow box flag and the flag the honor guard folded.
Hello,

The OP, Russ35057, was/is USAF NG.

Ref:
USAF Retirements
https://static.e-publishing.af.mil/production/1/af_a1/publication/afi36-3203/afi36-3203_.pdf

"6.1.3.5. If the member chooses not to participate in a ceremony or if leave, hospitalization, or other reason prevents participation, the member’s commander or an officer designated by the commander will personally present the DD Form 363AF, AF Form 1344, retired lapel button, US Flag and any awards or honors that express appreciation for the member’s service. Do not mail the retirement certificate to a retirement address unless all other means of presentation have been exhausted."

Ron
 

Stealthmanx2

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Not disagreeing with you Ron on what is in 6.1.3.5. All that paragraph is saying is the member's CC or officer designated by the CC will present, that's all. What I was saying was if anyone was thinking it was up to anyone other than Russ (in this case) to order everything they were wrong. Maybe I read too much into it, but kind of got the feel. I posted a junior person normally is the POC, but that goes out the window when someone decides to not have a ceremony. Once that happens it is on the retiree to make sure all of the stuff was ordered. Sounds cold, but the hardest part is the ceremony and not ordering of the certificates, flag, and lapel pin.
This is the part Russ started the thread about, 6.1.3.3.2. "United States Flag. NOTE: Appropriated local Base O&M funds are authorized for procurement of these flags at no cost to the member. 10 USC §8681 authorizes the presentation of a US flag for all retiring members." Even though this is still in the AFI it is no longer purchased by through O&M funds and must be purchased by the retiree (at least the way it was when I retired last fall). So, if this is still the case his supervisor didn't explain it properly to him or his orderly room didn't explain it properly to his supervisor. Just because an AFI reads a certain way doesn't mean something has not superseded it and just hasn't been implemented in writing. If they changed the AFI every time that happened a new version would come out every month. I am not trying to get into a pissing contest here all I was trying to say is if the policy is the same (regardless of what the AFI says) on the retiree having to purchase their own flag, then Russ needed to just that. It sucks because it's in black and white and it sucks because you would think after serving 20 years it's the least someone could do. I was thinking the same thing and I retired at 30 years with more stripes than he did and like I said, I bought mine.
 

heathro1281

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I personallydeclined my ceremony, but advised my supervision I still want all the paperwork and certificates and other good stuff as I leave, and demanded (probably too strong of a word choice) that I have it on hand the day I leave for terminal as if I was to have a ceremony. Just because I decline the ceremony, does not mean I should not be afforded the certificates and gratitude of 20 years of honorable service. I am not directly replying to anyone, it is just all in my humble opinion. I just don't want a "ceremony" but I still want the proper recognition. I hope my opinion is being worded properly, I also would do the same for any of my troops.

Some people see a ceremony like doing a book report in school and they don't want to be up in front of a social gathering, it doesn't mean I still cant give them a firm handshake and awards in the office.
 

Stealthmanx2

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How you want to go out is up to you, 20 years is nothing to sneeze at! You have done more than 1% of the U.S. population. I highly recommend that you stay on top of your supervision if you are having them order all of your paperwork. I know every base and every unit is different, but if your supervision is going to do it be happy. Be happy but like I said, make sure they don't lose sight. I would also have them check to see if O&M funds are back to purchasing flags. If not, that will be on you to buy.
 

RonG

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Re: "Some people see a ceremony like doing a book report in school and they don't want to be up in front of a social gathering, it doesn't mean I still cant give them a firm handshake and awards in the office. "

Excellent.

I retired at the highest enlisted rank (grade) and my family had already left for a foreign country (Arkansas) where her folks lived. I was in Germany and did not want to arrive at Fort Jackson, SC for out processing (retirement) and have a bunch of SP4 (E4) rank soliders standing in the sun for someone they did not know. However, I should confess I am not big on ceremonies for myself. I did not attend my HS graduation; nor my graduation from a university; and other events. I was a presented with an award before my family left Germany so that was somewhat of a retirement event .

I did appear for three wedding ceremonies, but they were different:
--Junior year of HS was married in Mexico, age 17
--Married on our lunch hour by a JP in West Texas
--Married December 24th of a certain year with only the county clerk and judge in the room besides "us".

Interesting thread and I appreciate the insight offered by Stealhmanx2.

Ron
 

heathro1281

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Our Honor Guard is an award winning flight and has maintained years of exemplary service, they fund the flags and present them with honors every chance they get. We have had periods that they request the flags to be procured and given to them for folding and presentation. that is 1 great thing here, we have a couple large veteran cemeteries and obviously a large retiree community in California, our Honor Guard is very busy but because they choose to be involved at every opportunity. We even have Honor Guard augmentees as they are always super tasked. Our past Honor Guardsmen volunteer to relieve them whenever possible. Its a great community here that I was I would have been able to partake in.

How you want to go out is up to you, 20 years is nothing to sneeze at! You have done more than 1% of the U.S. population. I highly recommend that you stay on top of your supervision if you are having them order all of your paperwork. I know every base and every unit is different, but if your supervision is going to do it be happy. Be happy but like I said, make sure they don't lose sight. I would also have them check to see if O&M funds are back to purchasing flags. If not, that will be on you to buy.
 

chaplaincharlie

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I found tooth and nail for mine. I wanted the presidential certificates, CMSAF certificate, the flag, all that stuff. I ended up emailing my unit several years later, I was retired via the AFBCMR, and they forwarded it to the First Sergeant who in turn ordered everything and had it sent to me. He even obtained a flag and had it folded by the Base Honor Guard and got me the lapel pin. Don't give up.
Pursuing what you want usually get you what you want. Well done!
 

schkaka

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Well one last kick in the ass on the way out. I spoke with my supervisor and I wont even get a damned flag for my retirement! 20 Years total. 18 good guard years and of those 15 for active service and now i'm being told dont get my hopes up for even a flag. this is against AF regulations! I'm glad I'm a guardsman and dont live near my unit anymore. I dont think my commander is happy that the PEB and MEB found me unfit. just uncool. My retirement date is 23 April.... do I have any recourse what so ever? 60% dod 100% VA P&T for SA

I am in the same boat. i was medically retired november of 2019 and no certificate nothing. its like because i was a reservist who had an active duty medical retirement they dont want to handle anything
 

Russ35057

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I am in the same boat. i was medically retired november of 2019 and no certificate nothing. its like because i was a reservist who had an active duty medical retirement they dont want to handle anything
Yup air guard here. I guess I'll just thank my lucky stars I'm retired
 

eps17

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Its literally federal law that they provide a flag for retiring members.


10 U.S.C. 6141 - Presentation of United States flag upon retirement
 

schkaka

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Its literally federal law that they provide a flag for retiring members.


10 U.S.C. 6141 - Presentation of United States flag upon retirement

Honestly I quoted them the whole regulation and I still got nothing.
 
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