TIMELINE: MEB THROUGH PEB

Purple

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
surfer495,

I'm from Texas. I haven't made up my mind if I will settle in Atlanta or Texas. I know I'm probably leaving the east coast though. I've been stationed on the east coast at two different duty stations for a period of eight years. I've been looking at homes in Tx and Atlanta via the internet.

I checked the vMPF daily too. I got my orders first, and nothing had been changed in vMPF as of last week in reference to my approved retirement date. Hopefully you will have better luck with vMPF.

Shasha,

You are welcome!
 

surfer495

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Purple, I was reading on another post, you were talking about selling leave back. I get confused here...So, I'll be given 40 days to separate and I have around 37 days of leave. Will I be able to take all of my leave as terminal and outprocess? My view on this is I've earned these days and I want to take them. Well, I guess I might sell some back. I can take 20 PTDY and 20 terminal. As long as I don't have to work anymore following receiving my orders, I will be happy.
 

Purple

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
surfer495,

according to AFPC, for medical separation/retirement, terminal leave is not authorized. The member must sell leave back up to a total of 60 days.

Also, if the member's commander approve, the member may take up to 20 PTDY. On another post, I have the link to AFPC website with this information. I will try to find it and post it here.
 

Purple

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
surfer495,

this is part two of my last post...

If you go to the AFPC home page and click on the military tab, scroll down to disability program, and open item number 17, you may be able to find answers to your questions too. It covers the disability evaluation system. http://ask.afpc.randolph.af.mil/
Here it addresses leave.
 

SSBN_Trident

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Hmm.... I wounder about Navy? I have hoping to use that leave for house hunting and relocation...
 

surfer495

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Thanks Purple for that information. I think it is dumb they make you sell it back. I don't know what I am going to do with all that time...outprocessing isn't going to take all that long. Its not like I have a job to do anymore now that my unit knows I am seperating.
 

Purple

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
surfer495,

I've been working at my unit the whole time, and I'm still working. My final out is 1 Jul, and my household goods will be picked up on the 30th of June. I will be finished with work sometime this week.
 

Jason Perry

Benevolent Leader
Site Founder
Staff Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Registered Member
I am almost certain that it is the same for all services. I will try to find the regulation (it must either be a DOD Reg, or part of the Financial Management Regulation). I am speculating that the rationale is that once your case is processed, they want to move you off the rolls so you don't acrue more benefits (in some cases, if allowed to take all leave, it might push you over 20 years, for example) and because it is viewed that they do not have authority to retain you "unreasonably" long thereafter.
 

tra777

PEB Forum Regular Member
On AFPC's website if you have already sold up to 60 days......

"Any unsellable leave will be used in the computation of your date of separation/retirement. However, some Air Reserve Component members are eligible to sell back in excess of 60 days and will be required to do so."

Found here: AFPC - Air Force Personnel Center

This is for Air Force. Not sure about other services.
 

Jason Perry

Benevolent Leader
Site Founder
Staff Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Registered Member
tra777,

Thanks for posting that! The way I read this, if you have 60 or less days, you will be required to "sell back" the first 60 days. So, the rest will apply to those with more than 60 days saved. For these members, they will have to sell the first 60, then any excess will be used to adjust retirement/ date.

What also comes into play here is "use or lose" rules on accruing leave. I know there have been adjustments to this rule recently for deployed members. For most, the use or lose will cap the days you have at 60. But for some with Special Leave Accrual eligibility, or perhaps those who have previously sold leave there may actually be situations where you could end up with adjusted dates (which, then could be used to push you over 20 years in rare circumstances, I suppose).

As for is this applies across all services, if one service does it, it is probably permissible by law, the next question is if a service has different regulations on this point. I would tend to think it would apply uniformly, though.

I still caution everyone though that it is best to consult the law and regulations directly for a definitive answer to these types of questions. In most cases, references from .mil web pages are authoratative, however, I think looking at the law/regs are important to be assured.
 

tra777

PEB Forum Regular Member
This is the Air Force policy from AFI 36-3212.
Note 5.19.2. for leave computation

5.19. Date of Disability Retirement or Discharge.
5.19.1. HQ AFPC/DPPD determines the retirement or discharge date no later than 10 days from the date of the Secretarial determination of unfitness. Appropriate processing and permissive TDY time will be considered before the effective retirement date is established.

5.19.2. If members have not previously sold 60 days of accrued leave after 10 February 1976, they must sell the leave at separation or retirement. Members retiring or separating for disability may use accrued leave that they can not sell back. If they have sold the maximum leave permitted by law, HQ AFPC/DPPD will add their accrued leave to the 20-day processing time (30 days if overseas) to arrive at the final discharge or retirement date (see AFI 36-3003, paragraph 3.13.1).

5.19.3. HQ AFPC/DPPD will establish disability separation and retirement dates as follows:
5.19.3.1. For members serving at CONUS locations, date of separation or retirement will be
established as 40 days from date of Secretary of the Air Force (SAF) Memorandum (SAF) approving the separation or retirement;

5.19.3.2. For members serving overseas, date of separation or retirement will be established as 60 days from date of SAF Memo;

5.19.3.3. For ARC members, date of separation or retirement will be established as 27 days from date of SAF Memo.

5.19.4. HQ AFPC/DPPD has authority to make the following exceptions:

5.19.4.1. Early Discharge or Retirement. HQ AFPC/DPPD approves retirement or discharge
dates of less than 20 days, at the request of the member or the member's commander, and in the best interest of all concerned--if the MPF can complete final processing by the designated date. The member requests early discharge or retirement in writing; the MPF personnel relocations element endorses the request and forwards it to HQ AFPC/DPPD before HQ AFPC/DPPD issues the disposition instructions or retirement order.

5.19.4.2. Overseas. For members located outside the CONUS who elect to return to the CONUS for final processing, HQ AFPC/DPPD authorizes 30 calendar days processing time.

5.19.4.3. Hardship. HQ AFPC/DPPD may approve limited extensions, normally not to exceed 30 days, in cases where the member is facing an unusual personal hardship over and above that encountered by other members being retired or discharged for disability. Submit requests for extension through MPF personnel relocation channels.

5.19.4.4. Special Cases. Unless HQ AFPC/DPPD approves a later date, the date of discharge for basic trainees at the AFMTC is 3 duty days after the date of the Secretarial determination of unfitness. HQ AFPC/DPPD may designate other disability cases for retirement or discharge to become effective in less than 20 calendar days and will notify all concerned.

Hope This Helps
 

SSBN_Trident

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
So have you guys taken advantage of PTDY (Permissive Temporary Duty)?

This is what I have found on the Navy's side for Leave, but this pretty much excludes TDRL...
Permissive Temporary Duty messages 109/92, 123/93, 078/95 are now available.
 

surfer495

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
I came across something interesting about the terminal leave situation. AFPC refered me this, AFI 36-3003 para 4.7

As I read this, you can take your leave up to the established DOS and must sell the rest because they will not extend you DOS to take the leave.

4.7. Disability Separation:
4.7.1. DoD Guidelines. DoD processing requirements require members to receive payment for up
to 60 days accrued leave and affords them time to take any accrued leave in excess of this 60-day
limit.
4.7.2. Determining Retirement or Separation Date. HQ AFPC/DPPD (Physical Disability Division)
determines a member’s separation date, taking into account:
4.7.2.1. Leave balance and leave accruing in excess of the 60-day accrued leave payment limitation
for members entitled to payment for up to 60 days of accrued leave.
4.7.2.2. Accrued leave and leave accruing to the date of separation for members previously
paid for 60 days.
4.7.2.3. PTDY authorized.
4.7.2.4. Processing time. Members may take accrued leave instead of processing time.​
EXAMPLE​
:
A member previously paid for 40 days of accrued leave and has a leave balance
of 70 days. In this case, the member receives payment for 20 days and can take leave for the
remaining 50 days plus leave accruing to date of separation. If member is receiving payment
for accrued leave for the first time, he or she receives payment for 60 days. The member then
can take leave for the remaining 10 days plus leave accruing to date of separation. The established
date of separation remains firm and members forfeit accrued leave if unable to take

leave due to extenuating circumstances (for example, hospitalization or convalescent leave).
 

surfer495

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Alright so now I'm confused. I got my DOS today. It only took 8 days! But the date is 62 days away, and I am stationed stateside so it should only be 40 days. Based on the reg I posted yesterday on this thread, I should be able to take my accured leave up to that established date?? I have 39 days of leave accured, and another 13 days of PTDY (already used 7 of my 20). This would only leave 8 more days of work. I just need some clarification on taking my leave up to the newly established DOS of 29 Aug 08.
 

tra777

PEB Forum Regular Member
Alright so now I'm confused. I got my DOS today. It only took 8 days! But the date is 62 days away, and I am stationed stateside so it should only be 40 days. Based on the reg I posted yesterday on this thread, I should be able to take my accured leave up to that established date?? I have 39 days of leave accured, and another 13 days of PTDY (already used 7 of my 20). This would only leave 8 more days of work. I just need some clarification on taking my leave up to the newly established DOS of 29 Aug 08.
Surfer495,

Have you sold back leave any time in your career?
 

surfer495

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
No, I haven't sold any days back. I really just don't get it. If I have time to take my leave before my newly established DOS, why wouldn't I be able to take the terminal?
 

tra777

PEB Forum Regular Member
That's not making sense to me either. I wonder if it is duty days that they are counting. That would make more sense because that would put you more around the 40 day mark. If that's the case, the 4th of July would not be counted and you gained another couple of days because leave is still accumulating as long as you are active duy. As far as your permissive, was the permissive for DTAP/TAP?

I'm just guessing so when you confirm let us know.
 

surfer495

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Alright I called AFPC for clarification on this. They said it would be up to my commander to sign off for terminal leave. Since I have 39 days of leave and about 60 days until my new DOS, I would be allowed to take my leave. I guess the selling back thing is only for leave that would put you beyond your newly established DOS. This works out better for me because now I will get BAS and BAH for those days instead of the pay for selling the days.
 
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