Will I get anything from CRSC

wiko123

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Hello All,

I am at the tail end of this process and thanks to all for helping me understand the process. Now I am looking into CRSC and I am a little twisted on it.

here are the specs. Married with two kids, 100% P&T from both VA and DOD (PDRL), E-8 Army National Guard with 23 years (I have my 20 year letter). my only active duty was the two tours OIF and OEF. Disqualifying were the PTSD and bum Knee both combat related.

For the life of me I cant make heads or tails on this CRSC and how much it would be if any. Any idea on what I would get from CRSC?
 

Warrior644

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Hello All,

I am at the tail end of this process and thanks to all for helping me understand the process. Now I am looking into CRSC and I am a little twisted on it.

here are the specs. Married with two kids, 100% P&T from both VA and DOD (PDRL), E-8 Army National Guard with 23 years (I have my 20 year letter). my only active duty was the two tours OIF and OEF. Disqualifying were the PTSD and bum Knee both combat related.

For the life of me I cant make heads or tails on this CRSC and how much it would be if any. Any idea on what I would get from CRSC?
Welcome to the PEB Forum! :)

Indeed, as such, I shall defer to @maparker and/or other PEB Forum members to potentially receive any associated feedback. Congratulations, take care, and enjoy life! :cool:

Thus, I quite often comment that "possessing well-informed knowledge is truly a powerful equalizer."

Best Wishes!
 

scoutCC

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An extremely confusing subject and is never explained well during the process IMO. You posed an interesting scenario so I decided to read up on it. Have you read FMR volume 7b, chapters 63 and 64? I recommend it, better to work things through yourself than trust someone else's analysis. Hope mine is right though.

So CRSC is calculated 3 times.
1st they take your VA compensation for those conditions, that is the max your CRSC payment can be.
2nd they take your retirement compensation, CRSC cannot exceed that.
3rd they take what your retirement compensation would have been based on your length of active service, CRSC cannot exceed that.

Then they put in a note saying reservists length of service is based on reserve years for CRSC. Normally CRSC restores retirement pay given up to receive VA pay, but reservists with a disability discharge don't have to wait until 60 is the way I read 630803.B.2.

I didn't bother calculating your retirement compensation, should be higher than VA compensation, so my guess is CRSC would be the same as your VA pay, 3200ish. So my vote is apply for it.

A note, you said disqualify was those two conditions. CRSC can be paid off non-disqualifying conditions, though since you hit 100% off those two, it moots the point.
 

Qwiksting

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Scout, are you saying that in his situation, CRSC will be determined on his Reserve years? Is it because he is over 20 years? Or Do the people at CRSC do this with all reservist regardless of the 20 year letter. The reason I ask is because I applied for CRSC back in September 5. I had only 18.5 years reserve time. 10.5 AD and 8 reserve. I was under the impression they used the RPAS points to determine LOS.
 

wiko123

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I didn't bother calculating your retirement compensation, should be higher than VA compensation, so my guess is CRSC would be the same as your VA pay, 3200ish. So my vote is apply for it.


That was a good read. What I got out of it was CRSC will pay up to the difference between Ch61 and VA payments. So, My army retired pay is $3836 and VA is $3554 the most CRSC will pay is the difference between the two = $282.

Am I correct or am I still twisted and confused?
 

scoutCC

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PEB Forum Veteran
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Scout, are you saying that in his situation, CRSC will be determined on his Reserve years? Is it because he is over 20 years? Or Do the people at CRSC do this with all reservist regardless of the 20 year letter. The reason I ask is because I applied for CRSC back in September 5. I had only 18.5 years reserve time. 10.5 AD and 8 reserve. I was under the impression they used the RPAS points to determine LOS.
It says for reservists calculate the years of service according to 10 US code section 12733
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/12733
which is the same way they calculate reserve years for retirement. So my take is 18.5 years, not 10.5.

So, without CRSC you will get 282 from DoD and 3554 from VA, because normally you don't get recurrent receipt.

FMR 630101 states
Combat-Related Special Compensation (CRSC) was established effective May 31, 2003,
to provide special compensation to members of the uniformed services who have retired pay
reduced by reason of receiving U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs (VA) disability
compensation where a portion of such VA disability compensation is the result of disabilities that
are combat-related as determined by the Military Department.
--
So its intent is to restore the missing 3554 you are missing due to the VA offset to your retirement pay. If you have less than 100% on the VASRD for combat conditions, it doesn't restore everything, but if you are 100% for combat conditions, it should be a 100% restore.
 

scoutCC

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I suppose what I'm failing to take into account though is CRDP, which will also restore all your retirement pay. I'm not 100% if you have to wait until 60 for CRDP to come into effect.

There are some important difference between the two. CRSC is a special category, not taxable, not divisible in divorce (subject to child and spousal support though). CRDP is retirement pay, so taxable and a marital asset. I am not positive how CRSC responds to SBP exactly, since it is not retirement pay SBP doesn't cover it.
 

nwlivewire

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PEB Forum Veteran
As a NG/Reservist, you need to make sure your RPAS is correct.

The NG calls this document Retirement Points Accounting Statement.

Each SM is supposed to get a copy of this every year and they are to verify it is accurate and fully complete.

The RPAS is the official recording of all the time you have spent in military service.

It has dates of time served, what branch you served during that time, what type of orders you were on, and on and on.

There is a column that says something like Total Points Creditable For Retirement (or similar words to that effect). That's the column that is used to determine your total points that count toward retirement. DON'T use the Total Points Earned column as not ALL points earned for PAY in a career can/will count towards retirement.

********** Make sure this document is complete and shows all time served from every place/branch of service you were at/in - to include dates. Make sure all the time you served is accurate in TYPE of service - and the type of Orders you were on - Title 10, Title 32, etc.

OK. Once you see it's all there and it's accurate, look at the bottom of the retirement Points column. It will have the Total of Points over your career you have earned that WILL count toward Retirement.

A point is basically a DAY.

So, take that big number at the bottom of that column and divide it by 360. The 360 number is the amount of days used by the military to determine a YEAR.

example: 4,481 points divided by 360 = 12
12 X 360 = 4,320 days
with 161 days "leftover" 4,320 + 161 = 4,481

So this imaginary SM has 12 full years of service and some "leftover" time.

There are 30 days in a month - according to what the military uses for this.

The SM has 161 days "leftover".

Divide the "leftover" points by 30 to determine MONTHS.

161 divided by 30 = 5

The SM has 5 MONTHS

5 X 30 = 150
161 - 150 = 11 points "leftover"

That's less than a month, so those points are DAYS.

So it looks like this SM has 12 years, 5 months and 11 days time in service.

Hope this helps.

V/R,
nwlivewire
 

Warrior644

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I suppose what I'm failing to take into account though is CRDP, which will also restore all your retirement pay. I'm not 100% if you have to wait until 60 for CRDP to come into effect.

There are some important difference between the two. CRSC is a special category, not taxable, not divisible in divorce (subject to child and spousal support though). CRDP is retirement pay, so taxable and a marital asset. I am not positive how CRSC responds to SBP exactly, since it is not retirement pay SBP doesn't cover it.
Indeed, military retirees cannot receive both Combat Related Special Compensation (CRSC) and Concurrent Retirement and Disability Pay (CRDP). If they qualify for both, then DFAS shall automatically apply the entitlement that is most advantageous to the military retiree. As such, every year during Open Season, the military retiree will have the opportunity to change their election; open season usually takes place in January of each year.

For eligibility to the CRDP program, eligible claimants:
  • Are retired with 20 years Active or Reserve Duty
  • Are receiving retired pay (that is offset by VA payments)
  • Have a 50% + VA disability rating
  • Reservists and national guardsmen must be eligible to retire based on service, normally 60 years old
In reference to the relationship between Survivor Benefit Plan (SBP) and CRSC, SBP premiums are not deductable.

Thus, I quite often comment that "possessing well-informed knowledge is truly a powerful equalizer."

Best Wishes!
 

nwlivewire

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Indeed, military retirees cannot receive both Combat Related Special Compensation (CRSC) and Concurrent Retirement and Disability Pay (CRDP). If they qualify for both, then DFAS shall automatically apply the entitlement that is most advantageous to the military retiree. As such, every year during Open Season, the military retiree will have the opportunity to change their election; open season usually takes place in January of each year.

For eligibility to the CRDP program, eligible claimants:
  • Are retired with 20 years Active or Reserve Duty
  • Are receiving retired pay (that is offset by VA payments)
  • Have a 50% + VA disability rating
  • Reservists and national guardsmen must be eligible to retire based on service, normally 60 years old
In reference to the relationship between Survivor Benefit Plan (SBP) and CRSC, SBP premiums are not deductable.

Thus, I quite often comment that "possessing well-informed knowledge is truly a powerful equalizer."

Best Wishes!

Dear Warrior:

I am 70% PDRL, 100% P&T, and I rec'd my 20 year retirement letter from the NG BEFORE I was placed on PDRL.

As I understand your posting, I don't think I am receiving CRDP.

I am being told by the STATE that I eligible for my NG retirement now (DEC 2014).

But I was placed on PDRL in APR 2012.

My finalized VA ratings at time of discharge in APR 2012 (not counting the 0% ratings) are:

70%
60%
40%
30%
30% (SEP 2013 - retro to discharge)
20%
10%
10% (SEP 2013 - retro to discharge)
10% (SEP 2013 - retro to discharge)

I receive my 100% VA and the "leftover" amount of PDRL (PDRL was greater than my VA).
2,858 + 620

Should I have been receiving the equivalent of my NG retirement pay from MAY 2012 to present?

If so, how to correct this?

V/R,
nwlivewire
 

Warrior644

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Dear Warrior:

I am 70% PDRL, 100% P&T, and I rec'd my 20 year retirement letter from the NG BEFORE I was placed on PDRL.

As I understand your posting, I don't think I am receiving CRDP.

I am being told by the STATE that I eligible for my NG retirement now (DEC 2014).

But I was placed on PDRL in APR 2012.

My finalized VA ratings at time of discharge in APR 2012 (not counting the 0% ratings) are:

70%
60%
40%
30%
30% (SEP 2013 - retro to discharge)
20%
10%
10% (SEP 2013 - retro to discharge)
10% (SEP 2013 - retro to discharge)

I receive my 100% VA and the "leftover" amount of PDRL (PDRL was greater than my VA).
2,858 + 620

Should I have been receiving the equivalent of my NG retirement pay from MAY 2012 to present?

If so, how to correct this?

V/R,
nwlivewire
Indeed, unfortunately, I'm not a resident expert on the this particular subject as highlighted in black bold font above!

As such, I must defer to @Jason Perry and/or maparker and/or other PEB Forum members with specific targetted sound insightful feedback! Take care! :cool:

Thus, I quite often comment that "possessing well-informed knowledge is truly a powerful equalizer."

Best Wishes!
 

Jason Perry

Benevolent Leader
Site Founder
Staff Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Registered Member
Sounds like in DEC 2014, you should get CRDP. The CRDP figure is NOT your NG retirement as a baseline- you have to apply the CRDP calculation rules to determine the amount (recalling that there is a "cap").
 

nwlivewire

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Sounds like in DEC 2014, you should get CRDP. The CRDP figure is NOT your NG retirement as a baseline- you have to apply the CRDP calculation rules to determine the amount (recalling that there is a "cap").

Thanks Jason!
It looks like I can apply for my NG retirement and ask them to credit me with my CBHCO/CBWTU time thy had overlooked to credit me with.

If that happens, then I will need to be backdated CRDP since MAY 2012 since I had a 20 year NG letter before I was placed on PDRL.

And, I was aged 56 yrs/ 9 mths at time of PDRL - rated 100% P&T - with total time of 4 YEARS early retirement time credit.

Thanks Jason!

V/R,
nwlivewire
 

Warrior644

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Thanks Jason!
It looks like I can apply for my NG retirement and ask them to credit me with my CBHCO/CBWTU time thy had overlooked to credit me with.

If that happens, then I will need to be backdated CRDP since MAY 2012 since I had a 20 year NG letter before I was placed on PDRL.

And, I was aged 56 yrs/ 9 mths at time of PDRL - rated 100% P&T - with total time of 4 YEARS early retirement time credit.

Thanks Jason!

V/R,
nwlivewire
Ah yes, good deal for sure; again, congratulations! :)

Thus, I quite often comment that "possessing well-informed knowledge is truly a powerful equalizer."

Best Wishes!
 

Jason Perry

Benevolent Leader
Site Founder
Staff Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Registered Member
Thanks Jason!
It looks like I can apply for my NG retirement and ask them to credit me with my CBHCO/CBWTU time thy had overlooked to credit me with.

If that happens, then I will need to be backdated CRDP since MAY 2012 since I had a 20 year NG letter before I was placed on PDRL.

And, I was aged 56 yrs/ 9 mths at time of PDRL - rated 100% P&T - with total time of 4 YEARS early retirement time credit.

Thanks Jason!

V/R,
nwlivewire
Recall that you cannot receive your NG Retirement. See AR 135-180:

"Chapter 2
Criteria
2–1. Eligibility
a. To be eligible for retired pay, an individual need not have a military status at the time of application, but must
have—
(1) Attained age 60.
(2) Completed a minimum of 20 years of qualifying service.
(3) Served the last 8 years of his or her qualifying service as aReserve component soldier. Service in the Army of
the United States, without specification of component, is deemed to be service in a Reserve component. Service
performed concurrently in a Reserve component and the Regular Army, Navy, Air Force, Marine Corps, or Coast
Guard is not creditable as service in a Reserve component for determining this period. The last 8 years of qualifying
service need not be the last 8 years of military service, nor do they have to be continuous. Examples: An individual
who: Served 14 years as a reservist and then 6 years in the Regular Army must serve an additional 6 years in a Reserve
status to qualify for retired pay. Even though this person has completed 20 years of qualifying service, only 2 of the
last 8 years of such service met the requirement of (3) above. Thus he or she must serve an additional 6 years in one of
these categories to meet the requirement of the last 8 years of qualifying service. Served 13 years in the Regular Army,
then 7 years as a reservist, followed by 4 years in the Regular Army must serve an additional year in a Reserve status
to qualify for retired pay. Even though he or she has completed over 20 years of qualifying service, he or she must
serve 1 more year as a reservist to meet the requirement of the last 8 years of qualifying service.
(4) Performed active service during some portion of any of the following periods, if a Reserve component or Army
of the United States soldier without component before 16 August 1945:
(a) After 5 April 1917 and before 12 November 1918.
(b) After 8 September 1940 and before 1 January 1947.
(c) After 26 June 1950 and before 28 July 1953 (active duty other than for training).
(d) After 13 August 1961 and before 31 May 1963; or after 4 August 1964 and before 28 March 1973 (active duty
other than for training).
b. In addition, an applicant must—
(1) Not be entitled to retired pay from the Armed Forces under any other provision of law.

(2) Not have elected to receive disability severance pay in lieu of retired pay at age 60. Reserve personnel
involuntarily relieved from active service who are not eligible for retired pay at time of release, but who are paid
readjustment pay under the provisions of 10 USC 687, are eligible to receive retired pay under this regulation provided
they are otherwise qualified at a later date."

Aside from that, the overall thrust of your post seems correct.
 

nwlivewire

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Recall that you cannot receive your NG Retirement. See AR 135-180:

"Chapter 2
Criteria
2–1. Eligibility
a. To be eligible for retired pay, an individual need not have a military status at the time of application, but must
have—
(1) Attained age 60.
(2) Completed a minimum of 20 years of qualifying service.
(3) Served the last 8 years of his or her qualifying service as aReserve component soldier. Service in the Army of
the United States, without specification of component, is deemed to be service in a Reserve component. Service
performed concurrently in a Reserve component and the Regular Army, Navy, Air Force, Marine Corps, or Coast
Guard is not creditable as service in a Reserve component for determining this period. The last 8 years of qualifying
service need not be the last 8 years of military service, nor do they have to be continuous. Examples: An individual
who: Served 14 years as a reservist and then 6 years in the Regular Army must serve an additional 6 years in a Reserve
status to qualify for retired pay. Even though this person has completed 20 years of qualifying service, only 2 of the
last 8 years of such service met the requirement of (3) above. Thus he or she must serve an additional 6 years in one of
these categories to meet the requirement of the last 8 years of qualifying service. Served 13 years in the Regular Army,
then 7 years as a reservist, followed by 4 years in the Regular Army must serve an additional year in a Reserve status
to qualify for retired pay. Even though he or she has completed over 20 years of qualifying service, he or she must
serve 1 more year as a reservist to meet the requirement of the last 8 years of qualifying service.
(4) Performed active service during some portion of any of the following periods, if a Reserve component or Army
of the United States soldier without component before 16 August 1945:
(a) After 5 April 1917 and before 12 November 1918.
(b) After 8 September 1940 and before 1 January 1947.
(c) After 26 June 1950 and before 28 July 1953 (active duty other than for training).
(d) After 13 August 1961 and before 31 May 1963; or after 4 August 1964 and before 28 March 1973 (active duty
other than for training).
b. In addition, an applicant must—
(1) Not be entitled to retired pay from the Armed Forces under any other provision of law.

(2) Not have elected to receive disability severance pay in lieu of retired pay at age 60. Reserve personnel
involuntarily relieved from active service who are not eligible for retired pay at time of release, but who are paid
readjustment pay under the provisions of 10 USC 687, are eligible to receive retired pay under this regulation provided
they are otherwise qualified at a later date."

Aside from that, the overall thrust of your post seems correct.
I am assuming I will qualify for this based on what you quoted - if I understand this correctly:

"... (2) Not have elected to receive disability severance pay in lieu of retired pay at age 60. Reserve personnel
involuntarily relieved from active service who are not eligible for retired pay at time of release, but who are paid
readjustment pay under the provisions of 10 USC 687, are eligible to receive retired pay under this regulation provided
they are otherwise qualified at a later date."


Don't know if that "leftover" PDRL pay is considered readjustment pay under the provisions of 10 USC 687.

But when I get my packet and turn it in, I'll guess I'll find out soon enough.

Will keep you all in the loop as this goes around.

V/R,
nwlivewire
 

Jason Perry

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Site Founder
Staff Member
PEB Forum Veteran
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No....read the preceding sentence (in bold):
"... (2) Not have elected to receive disability severance pay in lieu of retired pay at age 60. Reserve personnel
involuntarily relieved from active service who are not eligible for retired pay at time of release, but who are paid
readjustment pay under the provisions of 10 USC 687, are eligible to receive retired pay under this regulation provided
they are otherwise qualified at a later date."
You would have to had declined PDRL and elected reserve retirement at age 60 (or reduced age based on credit for service).

Don't know if that "leftover" PDRL pay is considered readjustment pay under the provisions of 10 USC 687.
It is not readjustment pay- it is retirement pay.
 

Jason Perry

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Site Founder
Staff Member
PEB Forum Veteran
Registered Member
BTW, when I stated above about the overall thrust of your post being correct, I meant that you likely will be looking at getting CRDP in DEC 2014...but, not this:
CRDP since MAY 2012 since I had a 20 year NG letter before I was placed on PDRL.
The problem with this is that reservists, unlike active duty members, have an age requirement before they are OTHERWISE eligible for retirement pay had they not been retired for disability. The "20 Year letter" only states that in the future you would be eligible for retired pay (which you cannot then get, because the disability retirement makes you ineligible for reserve retirement for non-regular service). At that future point, you then become eligible for CRDP.
 

nwlivewire

PEB Forum Regular Member
PEB Forum Veteran
BTW, when I stated above about the overall thrust of your post being correct, I meant that you likely will be looking at getting CRDP in DEC 2014...but, not this:


The problem with this is that reservists, unlike active duty members, have an age requirement before they are OTHERWISE eligible for retirement pay had they not been retired for disability. The "20 Year letter" only states that in the future you would be eligible for retired pay (which you cannot then get, because the disability retirement makes you ineligible for reserve retirement for non-regular service). At that future point, you then become eligible for CRDP.

Thanks Jason for your response.

In my case, it's very possible (and highly likely) that a mistake MAY have been made.

I was given early retirement credit of 6 months (2 credits) - but only for my WTU time.

Having only those two credits, this would make me eligible for CRDP at age 59 1/2.

However, I was not given early retirement credit for my CBHCO/CBWTU time.

The CBHCO/CBWTU time - if credited - would give me an additional 14 credits.

14 + 2 = 16 total credits.

16 credits = 4 years TOTAL credit for early retirement time - NOT 1/2 year credit.

If 4 years turns out to be the CORRECT amount of early retirement time credit earned, then I should have been able to CRDP at time of retirement onto PDRL in APR 2012 or MAY 2012 - not DEC 2014.

I was 56 yrs/9 mths of age at time of PDRL retirement in APR 2012 (70% Army/100% P&T VA).

At this point, I'm thinking I should have never rec'd my "leftover" PDRL pay, but instead, I should have been receiving my CRDP pay - based on 20 year letter, age and total early retirement credits back in APR or MAY 2012.

Another poster on this site thinks I may have to send something to the ABCMR in order to receive CRDP retro to APR or MAY 2012, as the retirement folks may not have the capacity/authority to fix this and retro pay me back to the APR/MAY 2012 time period.

So what I'm going to do is send in my packet to the folks back in Ft. Knox and see if they do have the authority to fix this and retro pay me.

But I wonder this: If I do have to go to the ABCMR to get this fixed, I wonder how long it takes for them to fix this?

Years???

And of course, I'm not sure right now just what that "something" is that I may have to send to the ABCMR.

But I will send my packet to the Ft. Knox people first and see it they can fully fix this at their level first.

V/R,
nwlivewire
 
Last edited:

Jason Perry

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Site Founder
Staff Member
PEB Forum Veteran
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Okay, then if an error was made, you may well be due retro CRDP.

ABCMR would seem the likely venue to address this. It would be similar to any other application (DD149, along with memorandum presenting argument as to why your records should be corrected, along with evidence supporting the argument).

Hope it works out well (and easily)!
 
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