HELP: O3E at 20 years Active Duty (USMC), 5 years as Officer, wants to know options

J

Jason23

PEB Forum Regular Member
Registered Member
I apologize for the long title.

Background:
20 years in, commissioned time is 5 years. Promoted to Capt Dec 23. Currently on first LIMDU for TBI.

Nobody can give me a real answer on what my retirement will look like if it’s a “medical retirement” at 21 years and do NOT fulfill 10 years officer obligation.

I would like the correct data, so I can make an informed decision on medically retiring so I keep O3E retirement pay and if so, how much does that impact VA disability pay…or I finish my 10 years to get both retirement and VA disability. I was told since I am over 20 I do NOT qualify for TERA.

Thank you in advance because apparently my situation is breaking the system and nobody at HQMC or DFAS can give me a straight answer.
 
Jason23 said:
I apologize for the long title.

Background:
20 years in, commissioned time is 5 years. Promoted to Capt Dec 23. Currently on first LIMDU for TBI.

Nobody can give me a real answer on what my retirement will look like if it’s a “medical retirement” at 21 years and do NOT fulfill 10 years officer obligation.

I would like the correct data, so I can make an informed decision on medically retiring so I keep O3E retirement pay and if so, how much does that impact VA disability pay…or I finish my 10 years to get both retirement and VA disability. I was told since I am over 20 I do NOT qualify for TERA.

Thank you in advance because apparently my situation is breaking the system and nobody at HQMC or DFAS can give me a straight answer.
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Since you have 20 or more active duty years you will get all of your longevity pension and all of your VA as long as your VA % is 50% or greater.

Those who are medically retired via chapter 61 have the 10 year officer obligation waived and your high 3 will be off your highest 36 months of pay which of course will be your officer pay.

Since you have hit 20 years that MAY complicate things since you would be eligible for more than one retirement. I know that if your DOD% is greater than your regular retirement % you would be in the clear. I am just not certain if you were to be medically retired with a DOD% less than your regular retirement longevity % earned if that would be a problem. My best guess is that it would not since you would still be kicked out and forced to be medically retired. I just can't say that with complete confidence though.

Since you have earned a regular retirement you will max out compensation since you can't get more than the combination of your earned longevity pension + VA compensation. You will get that if rated 50% or higher in total by the VA like I said earlier. The nice thing about being medically retired is that you don't get screwed over and have to use the high 3 of your enlisted years if you don't reach 10 years in as an officer. Same thing for ADSO, or having to repay any bonuses for reenlistments etc.
 
Provis said:
Since you have 20 or more active duty years you will get all of your longevity pension and all of your VA as long as your VA % is 50% or greater.

Those who are medically retired via chapter 61 have the 10 year officer obligation waived and your high 3 will be off your highest 36 months of pay which of course will be your officer pay.

Since you have hit 20 years that MAY complicate things since you would be eligible for more than one retirement. I know that if your DOD% is greater than your regular retirement % you would be in the clear. I am just not certain if you were to be medically retired with a DOD% less than your regular retirement longevity % earned if that would be a problem. My best guess is that it would not since you would still be kicked out and forced to be medically retired. I just can't say that with complete confidence though.

Since you have earned a regular retirement you will max out compensation since you can't get more than the combination of your earned longevity pension + VA compensation. You will get that if rated 50% or higher in total by the VA like I said earlier. The nice thing about being medically retired is that you don't get screwed over and have to use the high 3 of your enlisted years if you don't reach 10 years in as an officer. Same thing for ADSO, or having to repay any bonuses for reenlistments etc.
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Will my retirement pay with longevity still be O3E even without 10 years due to medical reasons?
 
Jason23 said:
Will my retirement pay with longevity still be O3E even without 10 years due to medical reasons?
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Yes, you keep your O3E for retirement purposes on the ID card, DD214 and calculations for high three if medically retired even if you did not complete 10 yrs as an officer.
 
This might apply to this case:

Entitlement Amount (for Retirees Who Are Entitled to Retired Pay Due to Retirement Under Chapter 61 for Disability):​

A military disability retiree with more than 20 years of creditable service for retirement must still waive retired pay in order to receive VA Disability Compensation. The waiver amount is the amount that the military disability retired pay exceeds the amount of military retired pay to which the member would have been entitled to receive if the member had hypothetically been retired under another law (such as the law that permits voluntarily retirement based on longevity/years of service). As a result, the amount of military disability retired pay that a disability retiree may receive concurrently with VA Disability Compensation may be limited. (Disability retirees who retired before December 31, 2013 were also subject to the phase-in described above).

Example: A regular component service member is retired under Chapter 61 for disability in 2020 after completing more than 20 years of creditable service under 10 U.S.C. § 1405. The member is also entitled to VA Disability Compensation based on a service-connected disability that is rated by VA as 50 percent disabling. This member may only receive concurrent military disability retired pay in an amount equal to what the member would have hypothetically received had the member retired for longevity/years of service. Any remaining amount of military disability retired pay is still subject to the waiver requirements of Title 38 United States Code (U.S.C.), sections 5304 and 5305.

Ron
 
RonG said:
This might apply to this case:

Entitlement Amount (for Retirees Who Are Entitled to Retired Pay Due to Retirement Under Chapter 61 for Disability):​

A military disability retiree with more than 20 years of creditable service for retirement must still waive retired pay in order to receive VA Disability Compensation. The waiver amount is the amount that the military disability retired pay exceeds the amount of military retired pay to which the member would have been entitled to receive if the member had hypothetically been retired under another law (such as the law that permits voluntarily retirement based on longevity/years of service). As a result, the amount of military disability retired pay that a disability retiree may receive concurrently with VA Disability Compensation may be limited. (Disability retirees who retired before December 31, 2013 were also subject to the phase-in described above).

Example: A regular component service member is retired under Chapter 61 for disability in 2020 after completing more than 20 years of creditable service under 10 U.S.C. § 1405. The member is also entitled to VA Disability Compensation based on a service-connected disability that is rated by VA as 50 percent disabling. This member may only receive concurrent military disability retired pay in an amount equal to what the member would have hypothetically received had the member retired for longevity/years of service. Any remaining amount of military disability retired pay is still subject to the waiver requirements of Title 38 United States Code (U.S.C.), sections 5304 and 5305.

Ron
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Ron, thank you for that but…in layman’s terms. Thinking out loud: as long as my VA disability rating is above 50% and I am Ch 61 retired as an O3E with less than 10 as an officer. I would still receive full O3E at 21 years AND VA disability?
 
Jason23 said:
Ron, thank you for that but…in layman’s terms. Thinking out loud: as long as my VA disability rating is above 50% and I am Ch 61 retired as an O3E with less than 10 as an officer. I would still receive full O3E at 21 years AND VA disability?
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Yes

I am in this position. O3E more than 20 total and less than 10 commissioned. High three will be 03E, and if you are more than 50% you get both.
 
Hello @Jason23

If you are a military disability retiree with more than 20 years of creditable service for retirement and have a VA rating of 50% or more, you will receive the hypothetical Longevity portion of retired pay plus all your VA compensation. The average high three base pay will be used in the computation irrespective of having less than 10 years as an officer.

Authority (high three):

DoD 7000.14R Financial Management Regulation, Volume 7B , Chapter 1,
2.2.2.1

Ron
 
Question for a friend. They were medically retired after 21years of service. They have a DoD rating of 90% and VA rating of 100% PnT. They have a VA Waiver that is deducted each month from his retirement pay. Shouldn't he qualify for CRDP and receive full retirement and VA disability without having the waiver? It feels like he is getting screwed over each month. It's like he is being punished for being medically retired vs those who retire just after 20 and get 100% PnT. Anyone seen this or dealt with it? Should it be an easy fix by VA or DFAS to get his full entitlements.
 
NachoBNS said:
Question for a friend. They were medically retired after 21years of service. They have a DoD rating of 90% and VA rating of 100% PnT. They have a VA Waiver that is deducted each month from his retirement pay. Shouldn't he qualify for CRDP and receive full retirement and VA disability without having the waiver? It feels like he is getting screwed over each month. It's like he is being punished for being medically retired vs those who retire just after 20 and get 100% PnT. Anyone seen this or dealt with it? Should it be an easy fix by VA or DFAS to get his full entitlements.
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is it 20 years active duty? if so there shouldn't be any VA offset. The amount of pay would be calculated based on his earned pension + VA compensation and that is the most they will get regardless of their chapter 61 pension. If they have a 20 year letter thats different. They will have the VA offset until they apply for their reserve/guard retirement at eligible age. Also, you can max out compensation via CRSC if you don't have an earned retirement or if you have an earned retirement but not at the age to receive it yet. So that is some things to look into.
 
Provis said:
is it 20 years active duty? if so there shouldn't be any VA offset. The amount of pay would be calculated based on his earned pension + VA compensation and that is the most they will get regardless of their chapter 61 pension. If they have a 20 year letter thats different. They will have the VA offset until they apply for their reserve/guard retirement at eligible age. Also, you can max out compensation via CRSC if you don't have an earned retirement or if you have an earned retirement but not at the age to receive it yet. So that is some things to look into.
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Thanks for the quick response. It was all active-duty time. They take out about $1100 a month as VA Waiver in DFAS. He said he questioned it with DFAS when he retired in 2020, and they told him it was accurate. After talking to other veterans who retired with 20+ with 100%PnT they said they don't have that VA waiver, and they receive their full retirement and disability compensation. This all came about because I was just rated 100% after 25 years and I was wondering what to expect with my retirement/disability compensation. He was telling me to expect the VA Waiver when calculating my income. It didn't sit right with me and so doing research on it.
 
Hello @NachoBNS ,

There may be a wavier/VA offset for retired pay for those who qualify for Concurrent Military Retirement Pay and DVA Disability Compensation when they have 20 years creditable for retirement AND are a disability retiree. The waiver/offset is the amount the disability retirement pay exceeds the hypothetical longevity retirement amount. See below for info from DFAS:

Entitlement Amount (for Retirees Who Are Entitled to Retired Pay Due to Retirement Under Chapter 61 for Disability):​

A military disability retiree with more than 20 years of creditable service for retirement must still waive retired pay in order to receive VA Disability Compensation. The waiver amount is the amount that the military disability retired pay exceeds the amount of military retired pay to which the member would have been entitled to receive if the member had hypothetically been retired under another law (such as the law that permits voluntarily retirement based on longevity/years of service). As a result, the amount of military disability retired pay that a disability retiree may receive concurrently with VA Disability Compensation may be limited. (Disability retirees who retired before December 31, 2013 were also subject to the phase-in described above).

Example: A regular component service member is retired under Chapter 61 for disability in 2020 after completing more than 20 years of creditable service under 10 U.S.C. § 1405. The member is also entitled to VA Disability Compensation based on a service-connected disability that is rated by VA as 50 percent disabling. This member may only receive concurrent military disability retired pay in an amount equal to what the member would have hypothetically received had the member retired for longevity/years of service. Any remaining amount of military disability retired pay is still subject to the waiver requirements of Title 38 United States Code (U.S.C.), sections 5304 and 5305.

—-
Ron
 
NachoBNS said:
Thanks for the quick response. It was all active-duty time. They take out about $1100 a month as VA Waiver in DFAS. He said he questioned it with DFAS when he retired in 2020, and they told him it was accurate. After talking to other veterans who retired with 20+ with 100%PnT they said they don't have that VA waiver, and they receive their full retirement and disability compensation. This all came about because I was just rated 100% after 25 years and I was wondering what to expect with my retirement/disability compensation. He was telling me to expect the VA Waiver when calculating my income. It didn't sit right with me and so doing research on it.
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The only thing would be if he is getting more from his chapter 61 pension. If thats the case he won't get as much VA. Regardless of your chapter 61 pension amount you can't get more than the combination of your earned longevity pension and VA disability. If he got 75% DOD and he was paid 75% instead of 50% then his VA amount would be less. That would be the only other way it would work.
 
Oh, okay I think see what you are saying. They may be giving him more for his pension than he would normally get for his years of service because he was medically retired plus 100% VA. So the VA waiver is there way to recoup the difference of his (too high) pension and his VA compensation?
 
NachoBNS said:
Oh, okay I think see what you are saying. They may be giving him more for his pension than he would normally get for his years of service because he was medically retired plus 100% VA. So the VA waiver is there way to recoup the difference of his (too high) pension and his VA compensation?
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Yes that is correct. All you have to do to very is calculate his earned pension amount for his 20 year regular retirement and add it to his total VA compensation. That is the maximum amount he can get by law. If you take his current income between chapter 61 and VA and that total is the same he is maxed out.
 
Ok, we did the hand jam of it all, and it all adds up. What a weird way of doing things. Thanks everyone for the help.
 
If anybody can help, greatly appreciated.

Currently on 1st LIMDU, will end Jan 25. PCM stated he plans on initiating my 2nd LIMDU. Not sure how long they intend to keep me on LIMDU before MEB.

Questions are:
-if by the end of the MEB results, am I able to rebuttal findings to go back on full duty?
—if the above is the case, what is the usual timeline for this?

I know it’s vague, but without knowing ballpark figures. It’s been stressful anticipating retirement and job searches.
 
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